Rochester is immediately defined as being compliant: "I agreed. Just like I did with everything else." He is also tricked by his family, and therefore ends up married to a woman (a creole) who he barely knows, unaware of her genetic history. ALthough his marriage does save him from the financial disgrace toward which his life was headed, he does not originally possess much power. He, following the trend of his wife and her mother, is alienated and distrusted by the black servants. Instead of being the wealthy, white respected man, as he would like to be in England, he is isolated and becomes fearful as well - which is supported by his walk in the woods, similar to antoinette's reoccuring dream, and the fact that they live near Massacre. Paranoia and danger are clearly present.
HOwever, he does posses patriarchal power. From a feminist lens, it is obvious that Antoinette is oppressed/suffocated by the patriarchal society. Antoinette gives ito Rochester (sexually) and he continues to treat her terribly - only lusting, never loving her. By the end, he uses his Englishman power to completely revoke Antoinett'es identity when he symbolically takes her name away by calling her Bertha. And then as wel all know he locks her up in the attic.
So, in my opinion, even thoug hhis family ticks him and he is isolated, he learns to develop and execute his [ower as a man in a patriarchal society.
WHat do you think? Is he powerful? What in the language supports your view? Do he use or take advantage of his power for evil? Does it make you think more or less of him'? Or do you sympathesize with him... an outsider who had no idea what he was getting himself into?
I think that as a fairly affluent man in Regent England (although Wide Sargasso Sea takes place later on), I think Rochester is born with power and has a commanding presence in people's lives. First of all, he is a man, which in a patriarchal society, makes him powerful, especially in his marriage to Bertha. He is the one with the financial means and technically controls the marriage. However, what I believe gives him even more power over Bertha is his condescending attitude to anything that is not English; he is an Anglophile through and through and this Anglocentric viewpoint is evident in everything he does. His lack of questions in the narration in Part II marks his assuredness in everything he does, and his tone is certain: it is his way, or the highway, in a metaphorical sense. He treats all things Creole as garbage and inferior; nothing can compare to England, nor is anything on the island acceptable to him. He clings desperately to English customs, I think, because this hierarchical system is where his power and status are derived. His holier-than-thou attitude gives him a natural edge over Bertha, who has insecurities and lets them show, and is therefore dominated by him. His attitude makes me dislike him, but I still like him more than Bertha; I personally think she is still addled in the head and her point of view is not to be overly trusted.
ReplyDeleteI agree with both Elizabeth and Demetra. I think Rochester is a jerk and that as much as it is an issue that he has so much power over Antoinette, it is more of an issue that he feels entitled to that power. He believes he is in every situation because he chose to be and consented to it, and that his way of life is the superior way. I think because he feels this power he knowingly takes advantage of Antoinette.
ReplyDeleteI think Rochester is not powerful at all. How much power do you need to control a woman who has been isolated her entire life? Anybody in their right mind could have taken advantage of Antoinette and her fragile state, and Rochester just does it in a rude and unjust way. He is taken advantage of by his father and brother(clearly a sign of him being the weakest of his family) and it appears to me he almost uses his being english as an excuse for what he thinks is power. He has no power, nobody on Granbois is afraid of him for a second, Christophine would DESTROY him. The arrogance he carries around seems like a defense mechanism for his overwhelming feeling of lack of power, as is his desire to control everything. He tries to control everything, but in the end controls nothing, he is sent to an island, marries who his father wants him to marry, loses his "life" to be dragged to where his wife wants him to go. "as i agreed with everything else" is not the line of somebody with POWER its the line of somebody WITHOUT it. Screw that guy
ReplyDeleteHi Elizabeth! and Demetra!
ReplyDeleteI think this is an interesting question. To me, it seems that (Not) Rochester does not really care much about Antoinette and his power while in the Caribbean. This is because he is motivated by the £30,000 dowry and obtaining that money seems to be his only purpose and objective. So, he does not make the greatest efforts to assert his power, but instead knows that he wins in the end by getting his money. It's kind of like going to a stinky relative's house just because your mom will buy you a new action figure (a highly valuable commodity!!!!).
Having said that...
It seems that while Rochester is in the Caribbean, should he have desired a position of power, it would not actually be realized. Why? Because he is at the mercy of mother nature there - he can't stand the climate, he becomes feverish; he has little effect on the people--really he is somewhat in fear of their voodoo-like behavior. Rochester is out of his comfort zone. He's not enjoying high tea with crumpets in Yorkshire or London--instead he's being coerced by the setting of the novel into a state of insecurity. Whether or not he recognizes this insecurity is another question; but, it seems clear that Rochester is only really concerned with getting his money, and that should he truly want power, he would likely not obtain it--at least while in the Caribbean, a circumstance that would explain some of his motives for returning to England where he does have power.
In effect, Rochester sacrifices his comfort and power for the monetary gains that seem to matter more to him.
and hi erica and justin, who posted while i was writing
ReplyDeleteI think that Rochester has power because he is a man and because he is an Anglophile. As Elizabeth clearly stated, from a feminist lens, Rochester without a doubt is the stronger person in his relationship with Antoinette. He takes advantage of her simply because she is a woman; Rhys makes this point obvious because Antoinette is a weak, insecure person and so it is incredibly easy for Rochester to take advantage of her. He gets away with changing her name to Bertha, having an affair with Amelie, and locking her up in the attic in England. Had Rochester been a caring person who did not hold so much power, he would NOT have been able to virtually take her identity away. The fact that he did makes me think much less of him now than how I felt when I read Jane Eyre. I also think that Rochester thinks he is powerful because of his Anglophile views, as Demetra said. His condescending tone and absence of questions clearly shows that he puts himself above everyone else. In fact, I think that Rochester believes himself to be so above others that he does not feel the need to exert his power all the time - put simply, it would be useless for him to do so because he already knows he is more powerful. It is for this reason that Rochester says, "as I agreed with everything else.." Also, he does not point blank exert his influence over the servants at Granbois. I think that Rochester's condescending tone and absence of questions makes all the more sense if readers look at the situation from this point of view.
ReplyDeleteI believe that Rochester clearly has power over Antoinette, but I also feel that he does not have much power in the community in which he lives. Rochester takes advantage of Antoinette because it is comforting to him to know that he is stronger than her. He is very insecure and isolated from all he knows, and therefore Rochester has little power. Rochester getting lost in the woods is a clear sign that misses England and is uncomfortable with his position in Granbois. I now see Rochester in a lesser light than I did after reading Jane Eyre because Wide Sargasso Sea shows how Rochester lets his insecurities control his actions and pick on Antoinette. To me, Rochester is the big bully who picks on smaller kids in order to combat his past experiences of being bullied.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Justin. Although I agree that Not Rochester is obnoxious, condescending, and "a jerk" (as Erica calls him), this in no way makes him powerful. Also, his ability to have power over Antoinette is virtually meaningless given her gender, background, status, and already incredibly low self esteem. I think that, as Justin and Elizabeth mentioned, his clear inferiority to his father and brother prove that he is very weak and not powerful in comparison to other men. Also, because he constantly uses his English background to assert his dominance and "power" it shows us that this is his ONLY source of power. He clings to this because he really is not powerful and despite his desire to be a powerful male in a patriarchal society, which really can't be that difficult, Not Rochester is not nearly as powerful as he would like to be.
ReplyDeleteAs a huge fan of Bertha/Antionette, I hate not rochester. I also do not think that he has much power, or that he thinks he has much power. For most men in that time period being dominant and playing one's assigned role in a patriarchal society. Therefore his superior attitude towards Antionette is not unheard of or proof of his "power". Also i don't think his affair with Emelie is anything special as well, this is because things like that were pretty common. In addition although I dislike him for it, Mr. Rochester's "imprisonment" of Bertha also does not demonstrate his power. This is because at the time there was no other way to deal with a lunatic other than killing them, locking them up, or letting them run wild. This is because there were no insane asylums and there was no antipsychotic medication. The one thing that might make Rochester be seen as a powerful figure is as Elizabeth said, is how he demeans Antionette by calling her Bertha (Why did he choose Bertha anyway????)
ReplyDeleteI think Rochester clearly exerts power over Antoinette by taking advantage of her weakness and insecurity. He is able to manipulate her, both mentally and sexually. He changes her name to Bertha and in a sense, strips her of her past identity. He also brings her to England, a place she considers Hell, and locks her in an attic. He is able to control Antoinette because of her open insecurities. Additionally, I agree with Demetra and the others that Rochester’s power and arrogance stems from his anglophile views. His tone in Part 2 is confident and condescending because he sees himself as superior to the others. He even has the audacity to tell Christophine to leave when everyone else is scared of her powers. After reading Wide Sargasso Sea, I see Rochester in a different light. In Jane Eyre, I felt sorry for him because he was stuck in a marriage to a monster. But after reading this, Rochester seems like a jerk who toyed with Antoinette and eventually led her to become crazy.
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ReplyDeleteI think Rochester would not be so powerful under normal circumstances; he lacks the home field advantage of knowing the land and the people there. He has no history, no claim to a reputation, and is clearly the outsider. So easily could he fall into a lesser state of control because Antoinette is in the position of living in a home she knows, surrounded by lifelong companions, and yet she lets Rochester take over her emotions and affairs. Rochester derives his power from really one source, Antoinette. She allows him to spin gossip away from her favor, lets him mistrust her, and becomes so completely obsessed with trying to win his love and affection, she loses control over her emotions, her rationalization, and her ability to defend herself. She slips below him into her depression and insanity, and this by default gives Rochester power over her. He can manipulate her by toying with her emotions and depriving her of happiness and love, and then also as a piece of historical context, by the terms of their marriage, he controls her money and finances, so she has no means of leaving him. Rochester has trapped Antoinette in a web of submission, which it seems she allowed him to create, thus giving him complete power over her. In many other ways he is not powerful; he cannot control the neighbors around them who spread gossip and harmful rumors, or gain respect or admiration of the servants in the house. He is generally despised by most of the people around him, and I think also by most readers, and this doesn't give him much leverage for power in other situations. So I think Rochester is quite powerful with respect to his relationship with his wife, but it is mostly because she let him take such a role.
ReplyDeleteIn respect to the other characters in the novel, Rochester definitely has power. He controls his marriage with Antoinette, and basically strips his wife of her identity. Not only does he change her name because "it is a name [he] is particularly fond of," Rochester sleeps with Antoinette and then goes into bed with Ameile directly after... and there are no consequences for his actions. He simply gets to move back to England, where he can attain even more power with his new monetary standing, and lock his wife in an attic. I definitely don't view Rochester the same way I did while reading Jane Eyre. Rhys portrays him as a greedy, selfish man who exerts power of his wife, gets what he wants from her and then moves on. If he didn't have power, this wouldn't be possible.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Austin and Justin. I think Rochester is essentially powerless, and he knows it,so he tries to exert his influence on Antoinette. He's like those people who get yelled at home or work and feel powerless, so they go and yell at other people so they can feel superior to someone.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Erica that Rochester is a "jerk,"but there is no excuse for his jerkiness. he consciously married Antoinette, no doubt only for the money, and he plays with Antoinette's emotions and affection. Even if he does feel powerless in the oppressive Caribbean environment, that does not give him the right to make Antoinette dependent on him, lust after,but never love his own wife, and treat her like,as George said, a Marionette.
So No, Rochester does not really have power in society, he just bullies around Antoinette so that he doesn't constantly feel like he is on the Totem Pole, which he is in Granbois.
Oh and I agree with George on the janitor analogy,that is essentially what I was trying to say
ReplyDeletegeorge i absolutely loved your comment... and agree to an extent.
ReplyDeletei also think everyones sort of siding with bertha too easily. her side of the story doesnt make me love rochester as much, but its first person, so we're supposed to question what antoinette says... and on top of that we know how psycho she ends up. so i think even though its sad how she was so alienated, and her husband didnt care about her and cheated - that doesnt mean im going to lose all of the respect i had for rochester. the cheating was definitely bad, but maybe he did it bc he wanted to feel like a man. its possible that though he spoke with a confident tone, he was insecure, and knew that since he was not in england, he was stripped of power. he was confused and alone. and in jane eyre we see how he does take care of bertha and tries to save her from the fire, and i think he is truly remorseful. - hes not all bad, he just has a dark past which we already knew.
george your comment left me loling
ReplyDeleteanyway, rochester's power is completely relative, but i think he is overall not so powerful. i partly agree with justin in that his power over antoinette is insignificant. she could be easily influenced by anyone (proven by the first paragraph, when she only talks about what other people think or say). so obviously it isn't difficult for rochester to see this or take advantage of it. yes, he uses her, which arguably could show some form of authority. but the important thing is that rochester could be replaced with any selfish human being and antoinette would still be subjected to their influence.
looking at rochester as a wealthy english man, he does have a lot of power. he is socially ranked higher than his black servants. but, as sarah mentioned, he is an outsider for the most part. if it weren't for antoinette's subservience, rochester would clearly be in the weaker position. this just goes to show that he doesn't have an authoritative personality, he just knows when a situation can be used to his advantage.
finally, the fact that rochester agrees to everything asked of him (as justin has already said) shows that he is passive rather than aggressive. this guy is only powerful relative to antoinette, but so is everyone else
I actually laughed when I read George's comment and saw his icon. Well done. I agree.
ReplyDeleteAnyways, I took a long nap, so a lot that is to say has been said. But to go along with what Ariana Wolk said, Rochester has a lot of -- perhaps all of the - power in respect to other characters. He strips Antoinette of her Creole heritage and of her name, and this loss of identity makes (or at least strongly coincides with) her madness.
When considering Rochester’s situation, there is no simple answer to how much power he has. As Ms. Siegel brought up earlier, he seems fairly content at first to go with the flow and follow the plans that the older generation has come up with. As explained in Jane Eyre, Rochester only marries Antoinette because he is interested in her inheritance and beauty. His actions were extremely superficial and materialistic, but he later realized what a fool he was. Wide Sargasso Sea does not have much sympathy at all for Rochester, while Jane Eyre clearly shows that Rochester later regrets his actions.
ReplyDeleteWhen Rochester was a young man, he had the power to make the right decision – to not marry Antoinette, but he followed his father’s plans because he wanted he wanted his father’s acceptance and love. While he married for all the wrong reasons, his actions are excusable. However, Rochester was later powerless to move on with his life because of his unfortunate marriage. Hard Times shows a similar situation between Stephen and his drunkard wife. The laws of that time period did not allow divorce, and Rochester did not want ruin his reputation. He had no power over his wife’s illness and no power to separate himself from her even though she was completely insane and determined to harm him and others.
i'm starting to agree with the justin-camp in that i don't really think rochester shows that he has too much power in wide sargasso sea. we see in jane eyre that rochester is very sure and demanding (forcing jane to socialize with his guests night after night, etc). in wide sargasso sea though, he appears to be more skeptical of himself. he asks tons of questions in part 2 ["(but she never laughs loudly and why is she laughing at all?)"] in the sentence structure alone, we see a shift in rochester's views of everything. in england, he is pretty confident, but in wide sargasso sea his powerlessness is evident in his inability to understand and control everything around him (since he is in a strange land, etc)
ReplyDeletewhat? you removed my comment ms. siegel.
ReplyDelete